Saydisc SD & CP sequence updates
There were various unaccounted-for catalogue numbers when the discography was published because many early records, although Saydisc branded with "SD" catalogue numbers, were small-run contract pressings for various mostly long-forgotten organisations or groups, with no archive copies kept. Similarly, records contract-pressed for small specialist labels were assigned SD catalogue numbers for in-house administrative purposes. Some were known because Saydisc's catalogue numbers appeared as matrix numbers but most were not, hence the majority of the gaps. Ongoing research has provided much better knowledge of the private label blues and jazz records that fit in the majority of these gaps.
Famous last words and all that* but it looks unlikely that any further unknown Saydisc SD sequence records will creep out of the woodwork. The book was published in 2010 and here, ten years later, it is a few years since anything completely unexpected surfaced. It's more a case of trying to match some of the gaps to contract pressings. (*I shouldn't have written that - August 2022 update, see the completely unexpected oddity that popped up as SD 170, below.)
Famous last words and all that* but it looks unlikely that any further unknown Saydisc SD sequence records will creep out of the woodwork. The book was published in 2010 and here, ten years later, it is a few years since anything completely unexpected surfaced. It's more a case of trying to match some of the gaps to contract pressings. (*I shouldn't have written that - August 2022 update, see the completely unexpected oddity that popped up as SD 170, below.)
April 2021 update: Which record was assigned which otherwise unaccounted for number for blues and jazz contract pressings is near enough confirmed - only two LPs did not include Saydisc SD matrix. Further research for Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story has surfaced which batches of UK Roots pressings were most likely assigned to the remaining batches of otherwise unaccounted for numbers. The blues-flavoured information is covered in depth in the new book, so below is comprehensive information on non-blues records (plus summary information on blues contract pressings).
SD sequence
Sleeve illustrations are only shown below where no image was included in the discography (see sleeve variations that have come out of the woodwork since publication). Sleeve images and full details for the blues records contract pressed by Saydisc are available in Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
Unknown catalogue number - St. Mary Redcliffe School Choir: Vivaldi Gloria, etc.
This 'known unknown' on p. 17, as documented from Saydisc's master list, which contained limited title or content information, has turned out to be the fully documented St. Mary Redcliffe & Temple School Choir: 1967 Recital (SDL 131, p. 20).
This 'known unknown' on p. 17, as documented from Saydisc's master list, which contained limited title or content information, has turned out to be the fully documented St. Mary Redcliffe & Temple School Choir: 1967 Recital (SDL 131, p. 20).
SDL 100 or SDL 110 (or both?) - Bristol Folks (1965)
The early 2020 PPL audit of Saydisc, which includes the original catalogue number of a smattering of early releases, has "100" assigned to each track from the LP. However, it then slightly muddies the water by duplicating the two Crofters tracks from the LP and assigning "110" to them.
I'd like to think that this is the answer to a lot of gaps between 100 and 112; that this LP ended up 'morphing' from 100 to 110 and that the rest of the catalogue started with 111 (see theory below) as the next number on. This is a much nicer thought than that there are still ten more records out there (101 to 110) from 1965 that have slipped everyone's mind.
(I also hate to think that there is a Crofters 7" single as SD 110, which is another possible interpretation of the PPL paperwork - though I'm sure that Gef would have mentioned a record by his own duo should it have been issued - and I'm sure one would have cropped up by now. Also, Saydisc did not 'do' singles - not until a one-off in 1981.)
The early 2020 PPL audit of Saydisc, which includes the original catalogue number of a smattering of early releases, has "100" assigned to each track from the LP. However, it then slightly muddies the water by duplicating the two Crofters tracks from the LP and assigning "110" to them.
I'd like to think that this is the answer to a lot of gaps between 100 and 112; that this LP ended up 'morphing' from 100 to 110 and that the rest of the catalogue started with 111 (see theory below) as the next number on. This is a much nicer thought than that there are still ten more records out there (101 to 110) from 1965 that have slipped everyone's mind.
(I also hate to think that there is a Crofters 7" single as SD 110, which is another possible interpretation of the PPL paperwork - though I'm sure that Gef would have mentioned a record by his own duo should it have been issued - and I'm sure one would have cropped up by now. Also, Saydisc did not 'do' singles - not until a one-off in 1981.)
There is another possible solution to the Crofters songs being listed on both numbers, which could also solve the missing numbers, 101 to 110. As the Crofters wrote songs, they recorded them to reel-to-reel and got them transcribed to disc at Stan's House of Sound studio in Marsh Street. These were not for release but for sending to potential music publishers, hence only needing a small number of discs (perhaps only one copy), which could be most cost effectively produced via Stan's disc cutter rather than being sent for 'professional' mastering and pressing. Perhaps these were assigned internal SD numbers? It could account for the fact that otherwise we have nine mystery numbers from 101 to 109 and also account for the mystery of two tracks also appearing on 100 and as 110. I'll get around to asking Gef one of these days - perhaps it's time for a Crofters/early Bristol Folk Revival CD retrospective with some bonus previously unreleased Crofters publisher demos!
Possibly SD 111 - Christmas Carols on Disc Musical Boxes (1965)
Given the above and that Bristol Folks could be both SDL 100 and SDL 110 (and assuming that no records were assigned to the 101-109 range, other than, possibly, as above, some Crofters publishers demos), it looks as though we have an EP with no catalogue number and a catalogue number with no record. Could it be as simple as slotting this EP in here? Although the matrix numbers on the EP (16179/16180) precede those on the LP (16185/16186), they are only four sides - or two records - apart so would have been in production at the pressing plant at the same time (the four matrices between would have been used on records from other independent record companies using the same pressing service).
My guess is that this EP was given an initial pressing run of 99 copies and that, what with undergoing a change of title along with having a bespoke sleeve designed for it, it was spotted that it had no visible catalogue number on repress for Christmas 1966 and was simply assigned the next then available current number - SD 119. (An aside is that assigning it a new number and presenting it under a new title would also mean that no Purchase Tax would have been paid on the initial 99 copies or the first 99 of the new run!)
Given the above and that Bristol Folks could be both SDL 100 and SDL 110 (and assuming that no records were assigned to the 101-109 range, other than, possibly, as above, some Crofters publishers demos), it looks as though we have an EP with no catalogue number and a catalogue number with no record. Could it be as simple as slotting this EP in here? Although the matrix numbers on the EP (16179/16180) precede those on the LP (16185/16186), they are only four sides - or two records - apart so would have been in production at the pressing plant at the same time (the four matrices between would have been used on records from other independent record companies using the same pressing service).
My guess is that this EP was given an initial pressing run of 99 copies and that, what with undergoing a change of title along with having a bespoke sleeve designed for it, it was spotted that it had no visible catalogue number on repress for Christmas 1966 and was simply assigned the next then available current number - SD 119. (An aside is that assigning it a new number and presenting it under a new title would also mean that no Purchase Tax would have been paid on the initial 99 copies or the first 99 of the new run!)
SDL 112 - Cylinder Jazz (1965)
The discography states that this was reissued as SDL 334, which is not quite correct. However, the entry for SDL 334 gets it right - the later release was a heavily rejigged version of SDL 112 with many pieces replaced on subsequent issue.
The discography states that this was reissued as SDL 334, which is not quite correct. However, the entry for SDL 334 gets it right - the later release was a heavily rejigged version of SDL 112 with many pieces replaced on subsequent issue.
114 - still unknown (prob. late 1965/early 1966)
This is probably a short run EP for a folk group simply using Saydisc to get a tape mastered to disc and copies pressed as a contract pressing (though at this point labels/sleeves would still be Saydisc branded). Saydisc used to target certain market sectors, leading to 'clumps' of similar records (e.g., local choirs, amateur dramatic societies, and schools). Based on SD 115 being a contract pressing for a non-Bristol-based folk group would tend to suggest that either Saydisc had advertised its contract pressing services in a folk revival publication or it was done through word of mouth at a gig at which the Crofters played.
An early theory was that this was a various artists folk LP, Liverpool Festival '65. The reason for this idea was that an LP with this title is listed in the "Terry Gould Discography" on the rear sleeve of Gould's 1969 Sing label LP, Several Kinds of Loving, as being a Saydisc release. Gef Lucena, however, has never heard of Terry Gould and nor does this record strike any bells in memory or surviving documentation. This is not surprising because Alistair Banfield has confirmed that Liverpool Festival 1965 (to give it its full title) was really issued on a short-lived Welsh label, Lynsound, which was pressed by MJB at Maidenhead.
This is probably a short run EP for a folk group simply using Saydisc to get a tape mastered to disc and copies pressed as a contract pressing (though at this point labels/sleeves would still be Saydisc branded). Saydisc used to target certain market sectors, leading to 'clumps' of similar records (e.g., local choirs, amateur dramatic societies, and schools). Based on SD 115 being a contract pressing for a non-Bristol-based folk group would tend to suggest that either Saydisc had advertised its contract pressing services in a folk revival publication or it was done through word of mouth at a gig at which the Crofters played.
An early theory was that this was a various artists folk LP, Liverpool Festival '65. The reason for this idea was that an LP with this title is listed in the "Terry Gould Discography" on the rear sleeve of Gould's 1969 Sing label LP, Several Kinds of Loving, as being a Saydisc release. Gef Lucena, however, has never heard of Terry Gould and nor does this record strike any bells in memory or surviving documentation. This is not surprising because Alistair Banfield has confirmed that Liverpool Festival 1965 (to give it its full title) was really issued on a short-lived Welsh label, Lynsound, which was pressed by MJB at Maidenhead.
SD 115 - The Folk'sles: Chicken on a Raft (prob. 1966)
Side 1:
Side 1:
- Chicken On A Raft
- A Long Long Time
- The Fireship
- Tees-Side Bridges
Either SDL 128 or SD 130 - Bristol Youth Choir (late 1967 or very early 1968)
In the discography, a 'known unknown' LP by the Bristol Youth Choir was mooted to possibly map to 138, 139 or 141. However, all of these numbers are now known to have been assigned to contract pressings for other labels (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for information). With better information on likely release dates, thanks to research on the blues book, the most likely looking numbers became these two, both of which were unknowns in the discography.
The piece of evidence that backs this up is that Saydisc tended to concentrate on specific market segments at specific times and close by we have LPs by the St. Mary Redcliffe School Choir (SDL 123) and the St. Mary Redcliffe and Temple School Choir (SDL 131). The link between these three recordings was Peter Fowler, who was a music teacher at St. Mary Redcliffe and Temple School and he conducts both SDL 123 and SDL 131. During this period he was also working extramurally with (surprise, surprise) the Bristol Youth Choir. I'm near certain that when a copy of the LP crops up, it will include conspicuous mention of Peter Fowler. (He later moved to Q.E.H. School, for which Saydisc provided another contract pressing in 1971 - CP 105 - after Saydisc ceased assigning its own SD sequence numbers for contract pressings in late 1970.)
Update: it is highly unlikely that a copy will ever turn up in light of recent communication with Gef at Saydisc HQ about Peter Fowler (email, 21 August 2022), "I think the Bristol Youth Choir LP was a short run of about 50 copies so quite a rarity."
In the discography, a 'known unknown' LP by the Bristol Youth Choir was mooted to possibly map to 138, 139 or 141. However, all of these numbers are now known to have been assigned to contract pressings for other labels (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for information). With better information on likely release dates, thanks to research on the blues book, the most likely looking numbers became these two, both of which were unknowns in the discography.
The piece of evidence that backs this up is that Saydisc tended to concentrate on specific market segments at specific times and close by we have LPs by the St. Mary Redcliffe School Choir (SDL 123) and the St. Mary Redcliffe and Temple School Choir (SDL 131). The link between these three recordings was Peter Fowler, who was a music teacher at St. Mary Redcliffe and Temple School and he conducts both SDL 123 and SDL 131. During this period he was also working extramurally with (surprise, surprise) the Bristol Youth Choir. I'm near certain that when a copy of the LP crops up, it will include conspicuous mention of Peter Fowler. (He later moved to Q.E.H. School, for which Saydisc provided another contract pressing in 1971 - CP 105 - after Saydisc ceased assigning its own SD sequence numbers for contract pressings in late 1970.)
Update: it is highly unlikely that a copy will ever turn up in light of recent communication with Gef at Saydisc HQ about Peter Fowler (email, 21 August 2022), "I think the Bristol Youth Choir LP was a short run of about 50 copies so quite a rarity."
Either SDL 130 or SDL 128 - contract pressing for Sunflower
It looks likely that the number not assigned to the Bristol Youth Choir LP was assigned to a contract pressing for Pete Moody's Sunflower label - see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for information.
It looks likely that the number not assigned to the Bristol Youth Choir LP was assigned to a contract pressing for Pete Moody's Sunflower label - see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for information.
SDL 138 - Barbecue Bob: The Georgia Blues Vol. 1 (1968) - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Kokomo
This was listed in the discography as being either SDL 198 or possibly SDL 188 because the test pressing viewed had a badly formed matrix in the run-off, the middle number of which looked like a mis-formed "8" or "9". A copy with better formed matrix later showed the number to be SDL 138 and that the LP had been contract pressed by Saydisc for the Kokomo label. For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
This was listed in the discography as being either SDL 198 or possibly SDL 188 because the test pressing viewed had a badly formed matrix in the run-off, the middle number of which looked like a mis-formed "8" or "9". A copy with better formed matrix later showed the number to be SDL 138 and that the LP had been contract pressed by Saydisc for the Kokomo label. For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 141 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for the Sunflower label
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 144 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Kokomo
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
Probably SD-148 - The Orchestra and Girls’ Choir of Park Senior High School, Swindon (1968)
Side 1:
In the discography, this EP represented one of the 'known unknowns', which Gef Lucena had narrowed down to most likely being assigned to 138, 139 or 141, which were otherwise unaccounted for. 138, 139 and 141 have all now been identified as contract pressings for independent blues labels (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story). Sadly, the news story only showed the label and front sleeve, neither of which included the number...but the photo of the record out of its sleeve shows a partial matrix number (just below and slightly to the right of the word "Bristol"), which, with a lot of squinting, appears to have a "4" as the penultimate number, hence going with the above number rather than SD 150. If only the photo had been taken at a higher resolution!
Side 1:
- Grand March (Verdi)
- Old Mother Hubbard
- Praise Ye The Father
- Behold The Lord High Executioner (Gilbert & Sullivan)
In the discography, this EP represented one of the 'known unknowns', which Gef Lucena had narrowed down to most likely being assigned to 138, 139 or 141, which were otherwise unaccounted for. 138, 139 and 141 have all now been identified as contract pressings for independent blues labels (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story). Sadly, the news story only showed the label and front sleeve, neither of which included the number...but the photo of the record out of its sleeve shows a partial matrix number (just below and slightly to the right of the word "Bristol"), which, with a lot of squinting, appears to have a "4" as the penultimate number, hence going with the above number rather than SD 150. If only the photo had been taken at a higher resolution!
SDL 149 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Sunflower
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
Probably SD 150 - Merrywood Grammar School (July 1968)
In the discography, this EP represented a 'known unknown', which Gef had narrowed down to most likely being assigned to 135, which was otherwise unaccounted for. This, however, has now been identified as a contract pressing for an independent blues label issued in spring 1968, which is too early a point for this record.
Gef remembers the recording date because it was the day after the July 1968 Bedminster floods - Merrywood being located in Bedminster and somewhat difficult to get to. With better information on likely release dates, thanks to research on the blues book, the most likely looking block of numbers became 148-150, all of which were guessed originally to have been assigned to UK pressings of Roots label LPs. SDL 149, meanwhile, was identified as a contract pressing for Pete Moody's Sunflower label, whilst the Roots LPs mooted were allocated to later numbers (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story - for information).
Therefore, if 148 is indeed the EP by The Orchestra and Girls’ Choir of Park Senior High School, Swindon, 150 now looks to almost certainly be this EP.
Another piece of evidence that backs this up is that Saydisc concentrated on specific markets at specific times (see 128/130 above). Sitting quietly as SDL 147 is another local school contract pressing, this by the Bristol Cathedral School Choir, recorded summer 1968 and marketed by the school. It is likely that either Saydisc had recently targeted local schools and that these two EPs do, indeed, fit in the gaps as assigned here (though just possibly, the other way around).
In the discography, this EP represented a 'known unknown', which Gef had narrowed down to most likely being assigned to 135, which was otherwise unaccounted for. This, however, has now been identified as a contract pressing for an independent blues label issued in spring 1968, which is too early a point for this record.
Gef remembers the recording date because it was the day after the July 1968 Bedminster floods - Merrywood being located in Bedminster and somewhat difficult to get to. With better information on likely release dates, thanks to research on the blues book, the most likely looking block of numbers became 148-150, all of which were guessed originally to have been assigned to UK pressings of Roots label LPs. SDL 149, meanwhile, was identified as a contract pressing for Pete Moody's Sunflower label, whilst the Roots LPs mooted were allocated to later numbers (see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story - for information).
Therefore, if 148 is indeed the EP by The Orchestra and Girls’ Choir of Park Senior High School, Swindon, 150 now looks to almost certainly be this EP.
Another piece of evidence that backs this up is that Saydisc concentrated on specific markets at specific times (see 128/130 above). Sitting quietly as SDL 147 is another local school contract pressing, this by the Bristol Cathedral School Choir, recorded summer 1968 and marketed by the school. It is likely that either Saydisc had recently targeted local schools and that these two EPs do, indeed, fit in the gaps as assigned here (though just possibly, the other way around).
SDL 154 - Texas-Louisiana Blues (1968) - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Highway 51
The discography assumed that a white label test pressing represented an album licensed from Highway 51, which was further assumed to be a US label. It has turned out to be the other way around in that this was contract pressed by Saydisc for release by Highway 51, which also turned out to be a UK label. For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
The discography assumed that a white label test pressing represented an album licensed from Highway 51, which was further assumed to be a US label. It has turned out to be the other way around in that this was contract pressed by Saydisc for release by Highway 51, which also turned out to be a UK label. For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SD 155 - John Newman & Pete Keeley: ....Impromptu Concerts in Pubs, on Beaches, and in Bus Shelters.... (1968)
Side 1:
Side 1:
- Young Girl Blues
- The Last Thing On My Mind
- New York Town
- Hold On To Me Babe
SDL 157 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Sunflower
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 160 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Kokomo
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 161 - Georgia Guitar 1927-38 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Kokomo
The discography is now known to show the tracks in incorrect order (alphabetical order by surname, I now notice) - this was probably transcribed from the wirz.de website, which still shows an incorrect (but now different!) track order.
The discography assumed that a white label test pressing represented an album licensed from Kokomo, which was assumed to be a US label. It turned out to be the other way around in that this was contract pressed by Saydisc for release by Kokomo, which was a UK label. For correct order track listing, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
The discography is now known to show the tracks in incorrect order (alphabetical order by surname, I now notice) - this was probably transcribed from the wirz.de website, which still shows an incorrect (but now different!) track order.
The discography assumed that a white label test pressing represented an album licensed from Kokomo, which was assumed to be a US label. It turned out to be the other way around in that this was contract pressed by Saydisc for release by Kokomo, which was a UK label. For correct order track listing, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 165 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Sunflower
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SD 170 - D's Independence At The Eastcliffe (1969)
Side 1:
Fresh out of the woodwork in August 2022, this unknown was assumed in both the original discography and in Blues From The Avon Delta to have been assigned to one or other Roots LP. Wrong, this is another contract pressing for the Isle of Wight connection, John Waterman. This EP is Saydisc's only known foray into (for want of a better term) pop music. The uncredited sleeve notes state:
Side 1:
- Rock 'N' Roll Woman
- Spooky
- Girl From Ipanima [sic]
- Hazy Shade Of Winter
- Heatwave
Fresh out of the woodwork in August 2022, this unknown was assumed in both the original discography and in Blues From The Avon Delta to have been assigned to one or other Roots LP. Wrong, this is another contract pressing for the Isle of Wight connection, John Waterman. This EP is Saydisc's only known foray into (for want of a better term) pop music. The uncredited sleeve notes state:
D's Independence have been playing on the Isle of Wight for just over a year, but Tim, Geoff and Viv have been together, in one group or another, ever since they first joined forces to play at a school concert in Newport in 1964. then the boys have a repertoire of two. Now, in their position as resident group at one of the Island's top night clubs, they have built it up to cater for all tastes.
Out of this they have chosen to record five of their most popular numbers "Live" at the Eastcliffe.
The line up was Geoff DuFeu, drums, Viv DuFeu, guitar, and Tim Marshall, bass and piano, with all three singing. This also includes Barry Cant on trumpet and an introduction from D. J., John Gould. John Waterson is credited as the person to go to for any information regarding this EP and it is certain that this was marketed by the group. It was certainly never a Saydisc catalogue item. Interestingly, for such a late item, it is on the generic light blue label design that seemed otherwise to have been discontinued in 1968. This probably represents the using up of unused old label blanks on a non-catalogue item.
SDL 174 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Sunflower
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
33SD 180 - Henry "Red" Allen 1929 / J.C. Higginbotham 1930 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - 7" LP contract pressing for Jazz Archive Special Series
The 'best guess' is confirmed - Saydisc catalogue number included as the matrix number in the runoff. See track listings, sleeve images and further details about JASS contract pressings.
The 'best guess' is confirmed - Saydisc catalogue number included as the matrix number in the runoff. See track listings, sleeve images and further details about JASS contract pressings.
SDL 183 - NOT RELEASED BY SAYDISC - contract pressing for Highway 51
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
SDL 198 - internally assigned to a Roots or Kokomo label LP
This is listed as probably being a Barbecue Bob LP, with an outside chance of the matrix reading 'SDL 188' instead - there was only a test press with badly-formed matrix in plain, white sleeve to go on. The matrix turned out to be SDL 138 (see above), so 198 was internally assigned to a Roots LP (with an outside chance of it being assigned to the last Kokomo label release) - see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for a best guess.
This is listed as probably being a Barbecue Bob LP, with an outside chance of the matrix reading 'SDL 188' instead - there was only a test press with badly-formed matrix in plain, white sleeve to go on. The matrix turned out to be SDL 138 (see above), so 198 was internally assigned to a Roots LP (with an outside chance of it being assigned to the last Kokomo label release) - see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story for a best guess.
SDL 210 - I'll Dance Till De Sun Breaks Through
The discography fails to mention that a reworked version of this was issued in 1983 as SDL 336. Tracks replaced from the original LP were 'That Mysterious Rag', 'Dill Pickles Hot Stuff Ragtime', 'Unidentified Cake–Walk', 'Black Diamond Rag', 'Ragtime Frolics', 'Alexander’s Ragtime Band', and 'Grizzly Bear'. These were replaced by/extended with 'Florida Rag', 'Alabama Skedaddle', 'Castle Walk', ''Tain't Nobody's Business If I Do', 'Wild Cherries Rag', 'Won't You Come Home, Bill Bailey?', 'Smiles And Chuckles - A Jazz Rag', 'On The Levee', and 'Trombone Sneeze - A Humoresque Cakewalk'.
The discography fails to mention that a reworked version of this was issued in 1983 as SDL 336. Tracks replaced from the original LP were 'That Mysterious Rag', 'Dill Pickles Hot Stuff Ragtime', 'Unidentified Cake–Walk', 'Black Diamond Rag', 'Ragtime Frolics', 'Alexander’s Ragtime Band', and 'Grizzly Bear'. These were replaced by/extended with 'Florida Rag', 'Alabama Skedaddle', 'Castle Walk', ''Tain't Nobody's Business If I Do', 'Wild Cherries Rag', 'Won't You Come Home, Bill Bailey?', 'Smiles And Chuckles - A Jazz Rag', 'On The Levee', and 'Trombone Sneeze - A Humoresque Cakewalk'.
SDL 212 - The Limonaire Fair Organ
The discography states that this was a contract pressing for 'A. Finbow'. This should have been 'R. Finbow'.
The discography states that this was a contract pressing for 'A. Finbow'. This should have been 'R. Finbow'.
33SD 214 - The Bells and Chimes of Inveraray (1970)
Side 1:
Side 1:
- Those Endearing Young Charms; Annie Laurie; Barbara Allen; Leezie Lindsay
- Bonnie George Campbell; Skye Boat Song; Ye Banks And Braes
- The Ten Bells Being Rung In Full Peal To Stedman Caters
- God Moves In A Mysterious Way; As Pants The Hart
- Godred Crovan's Galley; Leaving Lismore; The Inveraray Wedding
This was re-released, probably in 1971, on Fynedisc as 33FD2 (see details about the Fynedisc issue on 45cat.com) and included the same pamphlet as per a few of the originals. One viewed on eBay during 2020 also included a Localitho postcard of the church tower - probably a one-off but a lovely addition! The sleeve, also printed by West Brothers as per 33SD 214, is near identical apart from record company details and text colour.
33FD2 includes the original Saydisc 33SD 214 matrix crossed out in the run-off, with the Fynedisc matrix added, therefore using amended metalwork but still crediting the original cutting suite and engineer - a triangle and "H" on both Saydisc and Fynedisc matrices pointed at the lacquer being cut by Howard Barrow in Pye's Marble Arch Neumann SX68 suite. 33FD1 was also cut at Marble Arch, this time by Ian Cooper in the Westrex Scully Mono suite.)
It looks as though the inspiration for label name and catalogue number were direct 'lifts' from Saydisc - "Fyne" was chosen because Inveraray is toward the northern end of Loch Fyne. The question is, were 33FD1 and 33FD2 Saydisc contract pressings - there's something overall very 'Saydiscian' about them? The matrix numbers do not help because, by 1971, Saydisc had ceased assigning its own SD catalogue numbers to contract pressings (and the norm for Tranco was in any case to only include the label's own number as matrix and not any intermediary's number if different - Orlake did the opposite). Hence, both 33FD1 and 33FD2 might have been contract pressed by Saydisc. The Pye/Tranco and West Brothers connections suggest this - though Saydisc may have simply pointed Fynedisc at its own current manufacturing contacts.
Update: meeting up on 15/06/2021, on blues reissue business, Gef said that both are possibilities but that he simply does not remember, so the hunt is on for any surviving Friends of Inveraray Bells to ask!
33FD2 includes the original Saydisc 33SD 214 matrix crossed out in the run-off, with the Fynedisc matrix added, therefore using amended metalwork but still crediting the original cutting suite and engineer - a triangle and "H" on both Saydisc and Fynedisc matrices pointed at the lacquer being cut by Howard Barrow in Pye's Marble Arch Neumann SX68 suite. 33FD1 was also cut at Marble Arch, this time by Ian Cooper in the Westrex Scully Mono suite.)
It looks as though the inspiration for label name and catalogue number were direct 'lifts' from Saydisc - "Fyne" was chosen because Inveraray is toward the northern end of Loch Fyne. The question is, were 33FD1 and 33FD2 Saydisc contract pressings - there's something overall very 'Saydiscian' about them? The matrix numbers do not help because, by 1971, Saydisc had ceased assigning its own SD catalogue numbers to contract pressings (and the norm for Tranco was in any case to only include the label's own number as matrix and not any intermediary's number if different - Orlake did the opposite). Hence, both 33FD1 and 33FD2 might have been contract pressed by Saydisc. The Pye/Tranco and West Brothers connections suggest this - though Saydisc may have simply pointed Fynedisc at its own current manufacturing contacts.
Update: meeting up on 15/06/2021, on blues reissue business, Gef said that both are possibilities but that he simply does not remember, so the hunt is on for any surviving Friends of Inveraray Bells to ask!
SDM 225 - Big Road Blues - NOT ISSUED
The best guess that this wasn't issued is confirmed, despite the record being listed for forthcoming release in the 1972 Saydisc catalogue. For in-depth information on the non-release of this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
The album was eventually released twenty five years later as part of the aptly named Big Road Blues, the eighth volume in the Matchbox Bluesmaster Series of 6CD set reissues (MSESET8).
The best guess that this wasn't issued is confirmed, despite the record being listed for forthcoming release in the 1972 Saydisc catalogue. For in-depth information on the non-release of this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
The album was eventually released twenty five years later as part of the aptly named Big Road Blues, the eighth volume in the Matchbox Bluesmaster Series of 6CD set reissues (MSESET8).
SDM 237 - Spark Gap Wonder Boys (1973) - Cluck Old Hen - NOT ISSUED
Side 1:
Side 1:
- Cluck Old Hen
- The Milwaukee Blues
- Durham's Bull
- Faded Coat Of Blue
- The Black Mountain Rag
- The Dying Ranger
- Baldheaded End Of A Broom
- Colored Aristocracy
- Give Me Back My Five Dollars
- Lee Highway Blues
- The Auctioneer
- Wish I Had Stayed In The Wagon Yard
- The Good Physician
- Dill Pickles Rag
- God Made Women After Men
- Take A Drink On Me
- Wreck Of The Royal Palm
- I Don't Love Nobody
- Happy Trails To You
"As you know, we released the early Rounder albums in the UK and this one was scheduled at a time when EMI [via the deal with Transatlantic] were our distributors. They also did the pressings and this one was taken down as the shop floor ladies at EMI refused to handle it as one track contained [a certain rude word] (rather than ‘Cluck Old Hen’)."
275 - NO ISSUE - almost certainly intended for a Library Of Congress Field Recordings LP
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
276 - NO ISSUE - almost certainly intended for a Library Of Congress Field Recordings LP
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
For in-depth information on this LP and all things Saydisc blues-related, see Blues from the Avon Delta: the Saydisc Blues Story.
CSDLB 292 - The World of Mechanical Music (1978)
Side 1:
An original copy finally turned up, so the original inlay design can be compared to the second design as included in the discography. The track listing was unknown on publication because, although I had access to the updated cassette inlay, this did not include track details, which were instead were included on a foldout paper insert.
Side 1:
- Amarantina (Paso Doble)
- I Lift Up My Finger and I Say Tweet, Tweet
- Every Little Breeze Seems to Whisper Louise
- Yellow Dog Blues
- Heart Broken Mama
- Petersburger Schlittenfahrt
- Fahi Mich in die Ferue
- Operatic Medley
- Andante Spianato (Chopin) played by Alfred Cortot
- Wedding of the Painted Doll
- Flapperette
- Hey Diddle Diddle
- Mama's Gone Young
- On the Beautiful Blue Danube (played by Levitzki)
- Doe aan den Opbouwmee
- O, Kleine Herdersjongen
- Ik Heb een Huis
- En Douce
- La Java
An original copy finally turned up, so the original inlay design can be compared to the second design as included in the discography. The track listing was unknown on publication because, although I had access to the updated cassette inlay, this did not include track details, which were instead were included on a foldout paper insert.
SDL 314 - Devon Museum of Mechanical Music (1981)
This is documented in the discography as being a mid-price release with the catalogue number SDLB 314. This was, instead, a full-price issue as SDL 314.
This is documented in the discography as being a mid-price release with the catalogue number SDLB 314. This was, instead, a full-price issue as SDL 314.
SAY 321 - JOHNNY MORRIS: Geminee Geminii (1981)
There is nothing otherwise unknown about this but a video of Johnny Morris performing the song has appeared on YouTube, so we might as well watch it here. As per sleeve and label credits (left out of the discography because of space restrictions) Johnny Morris is joined here by the Bristol Children's Chorus and the Bristol Schools Senior Orchestra, not forgetting Gemini the sea lion and (not mentioned on sleeve or labels, though he appears in one of the photos on the sleeve) naturalist, Terry Nutkins, who reared Gemini the sea lion from infancy and was co-presenter of Animal Magic at that time. Ensemble directed by George Budden and conducted by Douglas Coombes, who presumably also took these roles during the recording of the song (Budden's name is not included on the sleeve or label, whilst Coombes is mentioned on the label only in terms of composing the music).
There is nothing otherwise unknown about this but a video of Johnny Morris performing the song has appeared on YouTube, so we might as well watch it here. As per sleeve and label credits (left out of the discography because of space restrictions) Johnny Morris is joined here by the Bristol Children's Chorus and the Bristol Schools Senior Orchestra, not forgetting Gemini the sea lion and (not mentioned on sleeve or labels, though he appears in one of the photos on the sleeve) naturalist, Terry Nutkins, who reared Gemini the sea lion from infancy and was co-presenter of Animal Magic at that time. Ensemble directed by George Budden and conducted by Douglas Coombes, who presumably also took these roles during the recording of the song (Budden's name is not included on the sleeve or label, whilst Coombes is mentioned on the label only in terms of composing the music).
CSDL 356 - Music From St Clement Danes (1985)
Not issued on vinyl. I only had access to the inlay when researching the book. I now have access to the cassette (though not yet the insert). The only thing to add so far is that the title is as shown on the inlay. The cassette labels have the slight variation, "Music from St. Clement's".
Not issued on vinyl. I only had access to the inlay when researching the book. I now have access to the cassette (though not yet the insert). The only thing to add so far is that the title is as shown on the inlay. The cassette labels have the slight variation, "Music from St. Clement's".
Saydisc's Contract Press (CP) sequence
CP 110 - West Cornwall Museum of Mechanical Music: Concert Choice (1976)
Only a white label test pressing in plain white sleeve was available to view during research. A normal copy has now come to light which surfaces the fact that all copies were supplied in plain white sleeves (inner sleeves were manufactured in April, which also provides the pressing date), though with printed labels and with detailed notes included on an insert. Hence the track listing below - the credit following the composer is that of the person that recorded the original of the piano roll:
Side 1
Only a white label test pressing in plain white sleeve was available to view during research. A normal copy has now come to light which surfaces the fact that all copies were supplied in plain white sleeves (inner sleeves were manufactured in April, which also provides the pressing date), though with printed labels and with detailed notes included on an insert. Hence the track listing below - the credit following the composer is that of the person that recorded the original of the piano roll:
Side 1
- Ballade Opus 23 (Chopin) - Theresa Carreno
- Barcarole Opus 33 No. 1 (Leschetizky) - Composer
- 6th Hungarian Rhapsody (Liszt) - Levitzki
- Prelude, G Min. Opus 23 No. 5 (Rachmaninov) - Composer
- March Humoresque (Ernst von Dohnanyi) - Composer
- Brilliant Waltz (Miss Mana Zucca) - Composer
- Andante & Rondo Capriccioso (Mendelssohn) - Josef Hofman
- Hungarian Rhapsody No. 2 (Liszt) - Alfred Cortot
The first two tracks on side 1 were recorded from Welte piano rolls, whilst the last track, side 1, and the first two tracks, side 2, were recorded from Ampico piano rolls. The last two tracks were recorded from Duo-Art piano rolls. The a-side label does not include the accent in Carreño and misspells "Teresa" as above. The side 2 label does not include the accent in Dohnányi, whilst the hyphen is missing in Mana-Zucca and "Hofmann" is misspelled as above. The label on the stock copy viewed is water damaged, hence the bleeding and staining of the purple colour over the silver overprinting.
CP 114 - FUMBLE: Rumble with Fumble! (1979)
Although pressed by Saydisc and assigned a CP catalogue number, this was presented on Fumble's own Rumble Records label design. The discography accidentally missed the exclamation mark from the title. The LP is lo-fi in the extreme, compiled from cassette recordings of various live gigs. It somehow works!
Although pressed by Saydisc and assigned a CP catalogue number, this was presented on Fumble's own Rumble Records label design. The discography accidentally missed the exclamation mark from the title. The LP is lo-fi in the extreme, compiled from cassette recordings of various live gigs. It somehow works!
CP 117 - Vale of Arrow Choir (1981)
The cover and spine both credit the artist as above, whilst the labels state "The Vale of Arrow Mixed Choir".
The cover and spine both credit the artist as above, whilst the labels state "The Vale of Arrow Mixed Choir".
CP-C 121 - Cotswold Male Voice Choir (1981)
The track listing has since come to light for this cassette-only release.
Side 1:
The track listing has since come to light for this cassette-only release.
Side 1:
- Wreck Of The Sloop John B
- Song Of The Jolly Roger
- In The Gloaming
- Kumbaya
- Art Thou Troubled
- I Want To Say To You
- Streets Of London
- Gwahoddiad
- Deus Salutis
- All In The April Evening
- Lisa Lan
- Great Is Jehovah
- O Isis And Osiris
- Morte Christie
CP 130 - The Hereford Police Choir (West Mercia Constabulary) And Richard Baker O.B.E. And Raphael Terroni (1984)
The discography credits this to "Massed Police Choirs", as per the pressing card at Saydisc. A copy has finally turned up with credits as above, along with credits for Musical Director, Alan Taylor, and Accompanist, Alan Jeremy. The track listing is no longer unknown.
Side 1:
The discography credits this to "Massed Police Choirs", as per the pressing card at Saydisc. A copy has finally turned up with credits as above, along with credits for Musical Director, Alan Taylor, and Accompanist, Alan Jeremy. The track listing is no longer unknown.
Side 1:
- Boedy Imja Hospodne
- Dashenka
- The Table And The Chair
- Absent Mindedness In A Parish Choir
- An Eriskay Love Lilt
- Where Shall I Be
- Spanish Eyes
- Stout-Hearted Men
- Memory
- Ill Wind
- The Lord's Prayer
- Love, Could I Only Tell Thee
- Gwahoddiad
CP-C 133 - The Echo Handbell Ringers: The Echo Handbell Ringers from Japan in Concert (July 1985)
Track listing currently unknown.
Cassette-only release. 250 copies were manufactured, and these were available for £5.50 incl. P&P by mail order from Vivien Rigby of the Kennet and Avon Handbell Ringers. The proceeds from the sale were to help fund the ensemble’s planned March 1987 UK tour.
It is possible that this was planned as an LP but not eventually issued in that format. The only potential evidence for this is that the single advertisement (in the 10 May 1985 edition of the Ringing World) states, “The Echo Handbell Ringers on Record”. The word “Record” suggests a vinyl-based artefact – a cassette is not the first format that would spring to mind in 1985. There is, admittedly, no mention of an LP, but also no mention of a cassette, merely the word “Record”. Am I milking this?
The album was produced by Saydisc from a recording made of the final concert of the ensemble’s 1985 tour at Maddermarket Theatre in Norwich. This was likely a hasty Plan B - see below,
The plot thickens. Gef at Saydisc remembers that the planned recording was cancelled at the last minute (email dated 28/09/2023):
Track listing currently unknown.
Cassette-only release. 250 copies were manufactured, and these were available for £5.50 incl. P&P by mail order from Vivien Rigby of the Kennet and Avon Handbell Ringers. The proceeds from the sale were to help fund the ensemble’s planned March 1987 UK tour.
It is possible that this was planned as an LP but not eventually issued in that format. The only potential evidence for this is that the single advertisement (in the 10 May 1985 edition of the Ringing World) states, “The Echo Handbell Ringers on Record”. The word “Record” suggests a vinyl-based artefact – a cassette is not the first format that would spring to mind in 1985. There is, admittedly, no mention of an LP, but also no mention of a cassette, merely the word “Record”. Am I milking this?
The album was produced by Saydisc from a recording made of the final concert of the ensemble’s 1985 tour at Maddermarket Theatre in Norwich. This was likely a hasty Plan B - see below,
The plot thickens. Gef at Saydisc remembers that the planned recording was cancelled at the last minute (email dated 28/09/2023):
I remember that we were going to record a Japanese handbell group who were on tour, but it was pulled at the last minute as [it was] discovered they were already under contract elsewhere. I thought it was going to be recorded by us at Fry Hall, Keynsham (now demolished!) but it’s a bit hazy now as to detail…I think that [the contact was via] the Kennet and Avon Handbell Ringers...
The group was indeed signed to Sony Japan. Further research into long-filed paperwork, found by Gef, now he knew where to look (for some reason, I had assumed that the three missing numbers in the discography had been LPs, not cassettes), surfaced that Saydisc had indeed gone ahead with the production, if not – by the look of it – the recording, the legalities having somehow been sorted out. Saydisc's pressing card shows that the full batch of 250 copies was delivered to Saydisc 20 June 1985.
Perhaps the original Plan A was also to make this available as an LP. I am trying to find someone from the Kennet & Avon Handbell Ringers to see if the details can be ironed out a little more.
Perhaps the original Plan A was also to make this available as an LP. I am trying to find someone from the Kennet & Avon Handbell Ringers to see if the details can be ironed out a little more.
CP-C 134 - The Monks of Prinknash Abbey/Nuns of Stanbrook Abbey: Compline (September 1985)
Cassette-only release initially. This was originally marketed by Prinknash and Stanbrook but good sales - 6,050 copies supplied between August 1985 and August 1995 - led to Saydisc adding this content to a compilation CD in 1994, Compline and Other Chant (CD-SDL 422).
Cassette-only release initially. This was originally marketed by Prinknash and Stanbrook but good sales - 6,050 copies supplied between August 1985 and August 1995 - led to Saydisc adding this content to a compilation CD in 1994, Compline and Other Chant (CD-SDL 422).
CP-C 135 - 1000 Voice Musical Spectacular (November 1987)
Track listing currently unknown.
Cassette-only release. 1,500 copies were manufactured and delivered, 1,000 in November 1987 and the final 500 in January 1988.
Track listing currently unknown.
Cassette-only release. 1,500 copies were manufactured and delivered, 1,000 in November 1987 and the final 500 in January 1988.
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